Could have gone to a better place, it would have cost me much less: Sri Sri Spiritual guru Sri Sri Ravi Shankar's three-day festival made headlines as much for his grand show as for the row with the National Green Tribunal and Delhi High Court who said the event was held on the ecologically sensitive Yamuna floodplains. In an interview in Bengaluru, he tells TOI the fest actually made things better, but he will think twice before venturing into the Yamuna again. M. D. Hegde
How did the World Culture Festival go? Did the response surpass your expectations?
It was amazing. I was very surprised by the response... by the way people stood, even in the rain, and danced the first day. The rain could not dampen their enthusiasm. I'm more surprised by the pace at which it's been cleaned the very next day. I thought it would take three-four days.
Couldn't the mounds of garbage on the Yamuna floodplains have been avoided by having better waste management systems in place?
Lakhs of people had food, water and other things. They can't take the garbage with them. All that has been cleaned.
Considering it is an ecologically sensitive area, couldn't this adding of garbage have been avoided?
First of all, had you seen the place, it was a dumping ground. Not a park, not a sanctuary. It was not a place with birds, it was not beautiful. It was stinking. Nobody would say it was an ecologically pure place. Today, it has become clean. The place was toxic. Our being there has not created damage, it has cleansed the place.
What was your interest in holding it at that location? Your previous celebrations to mark anniversaries were held in Bengaluru's Jakkur airfield, Berlin's Olympiastadion, places that can handle such crowds
I could have gone to a much better place, it would have cost me much less.
Exactly. Why didn't you?
The intention of having it there is to see that the Yamuna gets more attention, and it is easy for all people to come there. And the government should take notice of the cleaning of the 17 nullahs that was not done.
Is that happening? Or will it happen?
Now the attention is there, we will press for government to do that.
So you're saying the negative attention is a good thing, it has served a purpose?
The 17 drains of Delhi are going into Yamuna without getting treated. So... I have spoken about that already. Let me keep aside those things and let me come to the programme. Is there any place in Delhi that can hold such a programme? No place in Delhi can hold so many people. And so many countries participated. It's a pride for India. It's something happening in India.
As an international dignitary said, PM is talking about Made in India-Make in India, now this is Happening India. India has proven to the world it has the capacity to do something gigantic. Now we can even host Olympics.
We organised a massive three-day programme despite a terror alert and unfriendly weather without incident. This shows we have the capacity. One of the miraculous things is the stage we built. The NGT's main concern was that big stage. They did not believe it was without a foundation. A 3 lakh sqm stage, 40 feet high, they said it is impossible without a deep foundation. But this stage was on plates, we did not dig anywhere.... a floating stage sitting on the river bank. This is the most magnificent stage, the largest stage the world has ever seen — in itself a wonder.
Farmers raised objections and said their crops had been flattened...
Yes, there are people on both sides of the river. Farmers were cultivating, we have spoken to the farmers, we have given them compensation money for three days.
There was a lot of criticism about the army building pontoon bridges for your event. Did you request the Army's help?
It is baseless. It is the duty of the Army, of the government of the moment to take care of people's security. When 172 dignitaries of various countries are coming to a place, the onus of security and of free movement of people, everything lies on the government. They've done their duty. If they had not built the pontoon bridges, they would have failed in their duty to organise such a huge [event], so I thank the Army. In fact, we would have loved to have five bridges but we could have only three, but those three were done very well. There were holding grounds on the other side of the Yamuna with screens and chairs so people could sit there and watch. Otherwise, with such a large event, there could have been a stampede. We have good experience in organising large events without any incidents. We plan very well.
So didn't the planning team anticipate the possibility of damage to the floodplains?
If someone had raised this concern at least three or six months before, we would not have gone to this place at all. But when the stage is half done, just 20 days before the programme, when people have booked tickets, I feel this is done with malicious intention. It's not the right intention.
Why would there be malicious intent?
That I have no idea (laughs). You know, when an event of that magnitude happens, such obstacles come up. But it also shows how determined our volunteers are and we have made the programme a success.
NGT has said the floodplains were levelled, the soil compacted...
I have all the pictures, we are going to contest that sort of thing. But I want to say that NGT also said we have not violated any laws. We wanted place. They should have told me this place is not available, it is ecologically sensitive and we cannot give you.
Does that mean you won't pay the damages?
NGT very clearly said we have not violated anything. They have asked for a compensation. This is a very funny thing. It is like even if you go in a green light, you will get a challan (laughs).
Will you be paying the amount?
To develop that place, we are willing to do it [pay the compensation], but first we need to make it clear that it is not a fine or penalty as mentioned in most of the media. Fine or penalty is only if you violate a law but when you have obtained all permissions, where is the question of penalty? Only when the court clarified that it is not a penalty, we said ok, we'll pay compensation. We have paid compensation to farmers. We have no hesitation in paying this. If there is a fine, I will not.
You've said you wanted to have the event on the floodplains to highlight the state of the river. Will you continue your activities at the Yamuna?
I have to think about it now. Even if you do the best work, if it is not taken in good spirit, why should you even venture into such things?
So you're saying doing good has to be tempered and has to have results?
My commitment to doing something good to Yamuna is always there, but whether I will venture to do something there now, I will have to think.
Another criticism was about the enzymes that Art of Living released into the Yamuna to clean it. What were these enzymes and how were they tested?
Some of these experts do not have any expertise. They don't know what technology is being used around the world. Enzyme use is proven in the world. These people have no idea about it so they will object. That's why I said before doing good, you have to see what type of response you will get. It is easy to work with uneducated people, it is easy to work with educated people, but people with half-baked knowledge is a real challenge. They think they know but they do not know (laughs). That is the challenge but we need to go with patience.
Where did you test the enzymes and who ran these tests and verified the results?
We have labs, we have an institute with ex-agriculture directors from all over the country, we have experts in our institute. We teach farmers organic farming — one wing of our work. Scientists showed 100,000 Delhi homes how to prepare the enzyme that takes three months to make.
Was the government informed about the release?
The Jal Board chief is on our committee. The government, Delhi government, all were informed. It was all done meticulously. It was not some chaotic idea. They should look into the credentials of the petitioners. Who are the petitioners, what have they done? This is what people should do rather than question our credibility. Isn't it?
Did you have an expert team that did an assessment before you decided on the Yamuna banks as your venue?
No damage was done. We left the place even better than what it was before. In one day, they have removed all the garbage, I expected them to take more time. Our job is not to clean the Yamuna, our job is to clean the minds of people. I will first clean the minds of people and then make them clean Yamuna because we have so much negativity for everything. Instead of welcoming an effort which will make India proud... this big a programme has not happened in China...
China hosted the Olympics...
This is nothing short of the Olympics or FIFA games. This was webcast in 185 countries. How many cities this was watched in! If it was not something of importance, why would the world watch? Why would dignitaries from around the world participate? There were many firsts in our cultural programme. Another miraculous thing. Can you imagine a show of that size had only one day of rehearsal? The rest was done online. Thousands of people learnt the music, the rhythm [without meeting]... first time in the world such a thing has happened. We showed the world, such magic can happen.
When we put up the idea, people said it is not possible. Even for five people to sing together needs a lot of practice. We had thousands, especially the masterpiece with 30 kinds of dances in a sequence. We'll present this to Broadway and on such international platforms.
How many months of planning went into the Festival?
Almost a year. Dances and all, we started about six months ago. Real work started a year ago: venue selection, inviting guests. There are a lot of challenges — buses would get stuck, it was muddy. Because of my commitment to environment, I would not allow any tar or cement or anything into that place. No sand was brought from outside. It was all temporary structures. We would not have faced so many challenges elsewhere. Behind the sheds, there is still grass today. And the stage, no cement. Even the security agencies said they couldn't believe this stage would be safe without a foundation. Only plates and rods were used.
Where are your engineering experts from?
That is our speciality. We had to build a special stage for the Prime Minister because security agencies didn't believe it was safe. It is a new concept. Whenever you want to do something not traditional, something innovative, people do not understand. We have a very good team of educated, highly creative young people who should be given a chance to show their expertise.
I love to do that which is impossible. It is almost a habit for us to do something which is impossible and make it possible. Ask senior artists; they will say this is impossible without practice and coordination. Ask architects if something like this can be built, they'll say impossible. Ask environmentalists if so many people can be in a place without disturbing or destroying the environment, they'll say impossible. All this is presumption, they presume that environmental damage could be caused. If you see all they have written, they say environmental damage 'could' be caused. So, a presumption.
If you see floodplains, floods come and wash out whatever is there. It is not a hill we chopped off. People talk as if we have chopped a hill and made it a plain. All we did was level cornfields so that chairs could be placed for people to sit. We've taken good care of farmers. They're happy. The so-called farmers' agitation had farmers from outside. Even those farmers whose land we didn't need wanted to give us their land and benefit. For people living on the banks without power, we gave solar lights. We gave lights to a little less than 400 households.
Was the compensation to farmers for three days or for the period of construction? How much did you pay out?
They were growing keerai (spinach), cauliflower. Whatever they requested, we have paid.
MANGALORE
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